Yeah, I know firsthand about McGee’s stuck-up ways.
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With vuvuzela’s.
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And I’m just over here slightly annoyed at cloven hooves and ultra long legs, but like, okay.
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I could definitely see the latter, but, and as somebody from the MLP:FiM fandom (and I know you were as well), I never really saw the G4 setting, that being FiM, as purely “overly positive”. Like, this was the same show that feature two episodes that had apocalyptic/dystopian timelines, and at least a few stories where the bad guys won or evil triumphed for a reasonable period of time. The series also went heavy into its lore and worldbuilding, arguably moreso than its predecessors. I attribute that to Lauren Faust, the executive producer of the first season, and as pointed out in this article:
But Hasbro earned her devotion forever when Faust learned it also produced ponies with unicorn horns and wings. “That was the real clincher for me. I was already reading The Chronicles of Narnia, and I realized: My Little Pony isn’t just horses. It’s fantasy.”
Not to mention it had Queen Chrysalis and Changelings. Creepy, creepy changelings.
I know we’ve had this discussion before on the subreddit, but I felt that many of the people who we call bronies, especially in the initial phase, felt that G2 and G3 was more puerile. I know you have stated that a lot of anti-brony art in fluffy abuse feels like an attack on bronies and FiM(especially with how annoying that fandom got) but the antics and behaviour of some of the more innocent fluffies reminded me of the more child-friendly antics of G3 and G3.5.
I kind of value your opinion because there is a rift in the general MLP fandom, especially between the older fans of G1 to G3.5, and G4 (and potentially G5, since G5 is patterning itself after G4). A quick search on google has revealed some different takes here and on this article here: My Little Pony Smackdown: Girls vs. Bronies | Collectors Weekly
Based on my familiarity with MLP:FiM, I felt that the characters on that show were very aware that hugs and love don’t solve everything. And that part of the difficulty of friendship was working through problems. Its kind of why I feel that perception of MLP, especially latter fluffy artist/writers unfamiliar with G4 may be based on assumption of FIM that didn’t actually know what was going on in that show
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That’s fair.
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G1 wasn’t all that overly positive or happy go lucky either at times.
The movie and its TV follow up were down right vicious
…For MLP standards.
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I get that! Lauren Faust herself had sighted G1 as her influence when developing G4 and MLP:FiM. What I’m wondering though is G2, G3 and G3.5.
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Truth be told I do think that cloven hooves don’t really fit fluffies.
They should have soft round hooves.
I also often forget they are supposed to be horsies.
G2 was a continuation more or less of G1.
G3 had no real “lore” to speak off just the toys from what I recall.
Most of this "info"is filtered through a TF fan lens though.
So take it with a grain of salt.
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Carp’s influence was just that, influence. Just because Carp takes some of his ideas from Jberg doesn’t mean that Jberg has any kind of right to dictate what is more or less correct for a fluffy. Carp liked it, so he took it. Nothing to do with how popular Jberg is or his place in the community.
It’s true that the more popular someone is, the more their content has the opportunity to influence others, but that’s a matter of social happenstance. Claiming otherwise would be to legitimize the boom of jellenheimers after the Click’s videos. Content may be influential , but that doesn’t make it tantamount to canon.
There’s a difference between hanging on to popular or expansive stories and asserting that they are the model by which we ought to proceed. am I supposed to bow down to an artist or author because they happened to engage with the fandom first and are a better artist than I am?
Laughable.
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Of course not. However, it gets a bit weird when fluffies, formerly known as “fluffy ponies” since, y’know, that’s what they are, are portrayed as having human disproportionate bodies, equine skulls for heads, no fluff, snake-like appendages and be casually compared to “fluffy pony that can run faster than a snail”.
So, while I am all for “to each their own”, there still have to be some bases an author should cover in order to classify a creature as “fluffy”.
That being said, one shouldn’t stop to the trifecta of “how to fluffy 101: retarded, paper-thin fragile and not considered animal for no reason” and bash everything that deviates from it as “not being a real fluffy”.
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This and whatever it is Mcgee is doing are apples and oranges. He’s trying to make some abstract “Behold, a man!” statement, I’m just saying that the definition of a fluffy should be derived from the well intentioned expression of the individual artist, not a bunch of oldfags who aren’t even in the community anymore.
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I came into the fluffy Fandom after fall of Cleveland was wrapped up and which I think was around season two or three of gen 4. From what I saw of the main broney Fandom didn’t even care above previous generations except to guess what they could bring to the new series.
The first season of gen 4 was pretty tame and you can see some links to the Fandom drawing the main 6 as fillies ( based on the cutie mark crusauders) mixed with fluffy (blow dried) ponies that came around after rarity gets stuck in the rain. Add to that the weird grimdark stories like “cupcakes” where pinkie tortures and kills her friends and you get the fluffy community.
You also have to remember that the show had long breaks between and in the seasons when originally airing that allowed the fans to speculate and work on their own ideas.
And while later versions of the show got darker to appease the older fans, the idea is still based on kids shows in general that tend to be innocent and cute.
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Just to quote myself about how I personally see fluffies.
I think thats a good fluffy base to get started with.
But off course I would.
It seems i was also proven right with that.
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wow Oc, this sure riled people up
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And what would the definition of fluffy be, in your mind? I am curious.
Do you think there should be some “ground rules”, or everything is fair in fluffies and war?
But, I do agree that one shouldn’t bow down to what some people did way back when if they wish to not include it in their worldbuilding. As I said, I myself reject The Fall of Cleveland in my stories.
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I’d be more impressed if it wasn’t mostly shitposting in response to McGee
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I mean, we could keep arguing all day about the specific qualifiers that’d be necessary for fluffy status and keep bringing up increasingly niche examples where a fluffy did not exhibit those qualifiers but was still undeniably a fluffy, but we’d still argue over Fluffy Criteria over and over again, until the last person leaves the fandom after getting tired of arguing with themselves over it or the fluffy apocalypse is upon us.
But I think the intention behind a fluffy depiction is definitely the most important part. Are you making a fluffy, or a caricature of one just to troll (valid)? Are you making a fluffy, or some fluffy!au version of your beloved talking cat franchise character?
We will never stop arguing over this.
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Discussion is discussion
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I’m saying it’s a paradoxical problem. No one has the right to tell me what is or is not a fluffy’s not because there IS no definition, but because there isn’t anyone with the authority to enforce one.
Practically speaking, virgil and his team of course hold that authority, but only here on the site. If I didn’t like what he said, I’d just post somewhere else, and the fandom remains as fractured as it ever was.
At the end of the day it doesn’t matter what my headcanon is. I rarely bother to address it in my comics, I just draw what I like and let people think what they will. The only thing you can do is point to people who are so outside the pale that their works are very obviously not fluffies, trying to pass judgement close to the line is next to impossible though.
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